Evidence for Evil Spirits
Notable Deadly Departed Quote – Dr Richard Gallagher:
‘I know many psychiatrists around the world who believe exactly the way I do… They probably don't have as much experience as I've had because… I get calls from all over the world and I've seen more of these (demonic possession) cases. I'm also a member of an international Catholic association as a scientific advisor, so, you know, I've seen a tremendous amount of these cases. My former academic chairman who is a Catholic, he's retired now, but he wrote that I've seen more of these cases than anybody, any doctor in the world and probably in history.’
Deadly Departed - Evidence for Evil Spirits
Premiered December 15, 2025 - Runtime 1 hr
Deadly Departed Podcast guest Dr Richard Gallagher is a professor of psychiatry, psychoanalyst, Catholic scholar, member and scientific advisor to the International Association of Exorcists since the 1990s, and author of Demonic Foes: My Twenty-Five Years as a Psychiatrist Investigating Possessions, Diabolic Attacks, and the Paranormal. His book deserves a place on the reading list of all mental health study curriculums worldwide.
Key Points: Evidence for Evil Spirits Podcast
- Evil spirits: Belief persists worldwide, historically and today, with anecdotal evidence mounting from credible experts and centuries of reports.
- Materialism vs. spiritual worldview: Science provides tools for investigation, but some phenomena demand approaches that transcend materialist boundaries.
- Discernment is key: Not every evil act is caused by possession; careful investigation and rational analysis prevent over-attribution.
- The conversation continues: Empirical research, open-mindedness, and balanced education are vital as we seek to understand anomalous experiences.
Podcast Discussion Highlights
Certain spiritual phenomena resist conventional investigation
Dr. Richard Gallagher and fellow spirit interventionist Jock Brocas advocate remind us that throughout history and across cultures, the belief in evil spirits has been ubiquitous, and most people in the world, even today, hold some belief in malevolent spiritual entities. Gallagher advocates for a careful distinction between overt spiritual and psychiatric conditions, and wisely points out that mainstream science can only go so far because there are realities that transcend materialist paradigms, and certain spiritual phenomena that resist conventional investigation.
He also clarifies that modern psychiatry recognizes “spiritual or religious problems” in classifications like DSM-5 (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders) but stops short of identifying demonic possession as a clinical entity, and expresses caution about over-integrating spiritual phenomena within psychiatric models, suggesting that the field must maintain distinction to avoid controversy.
Why videotaping entities often fails and how skeptics keep malevolent spirits happy
Both Jock Brocas and Dr. Richard Gallagher share that firsthand encounters with anomalous phenomena profoundly shape conviction. Gallagher has consulted on dramatic cases where individuals display bizarre phenomena, such as speaking unknown languages or levitating, linked to spiritual attacks. However, he notes that attempts to capture these events on videotape often fail, hinting at the elusive and intelligent nature of these entities.
Notable Deadly Departed Quote: Dr Richard Gallagher
‘What I've also noticed... is that people who try to capture these things on videotape, often the videotape is interfered with. So they'll say, well, Dr. Gallagher, I tried to videotape it. I had it on videotape. But then the videotape disappeared. So, strange as it may sound, we’re not dealing with creatures who can’t interfere with our study of them, number one. So they make it difficult because… on the one hand, they kind of want to attack and display themselves to certain people, but to other people, they are very happy that people are skeptical. So it's a very hard thing to study. And as I say to people, they're not like Hollywood actors that are, you know, eager to perform for the camera. They're just not going to do that…’
Jock Brocas - Why can’t you catch them on video?
‘You know, and it's interesting, I think people need to realize, is that - and I tend to utilize this term spiritual intelligences or nefarious intelligences, as well as demonic, because they're a lot more intelligent than we are. And I've had this argument with many people where they say, well, you know, you can go in and say prayers and cleanse or do this… why can't you catch them on video? ... The reality is, whatever we try to do to circumnavigate in our own field of understanding, they're always going to be able to go beyond what we could even understand, which is why we need spiritual intervention, which is why we need holy intervention into this...’
Dr Richard Gallagher – I have no doubt that evil spirits exist
‘It's a paradoxical truth that on the one hand... demons do show their colors at times... The cases I write about, the possessions, the severe oppressions, even what we call the infestations, those are the main categories of overt demonic attack. But it's interesting, at the same time, they sometimes do that to punish people, to sadistically torture people, etc. At other times, they want to remain hidden. And it's almost like they have a strategy. You pointed out how very intelligent they are. They are, because… what we Catholics believe is they're fallen angels, and angels also are… very high intelligence.
And it’s interesting, if you think about it, because it's also confusing to people. At times they manifest themselves and obviously… if you're attacked by an evil spirit, you tend to know it, even though there are people who are delusional about it. But on the other hand, especially in the modern Western world, which is one of the few areas of the world in world history where people are skeptical of evil spirits, they think, oh, all these people are just, you know, psychotic and stuff. I mean, yes, it's true that... psychotic people can only imagine from their hallucinations that they're being attacked by spirits but… that's precisely why doctors like myself get involved in helping to discern these cases.
But it's interesting at the same time, that you and I have experienced so many anomalous experiences that we have no doubt that these things exist in the afterlife. And I have no doubt that evil spirits exist. On the other hand, to a lot of other people in our modern society, they actually try to hide themselves. It's a tricky balance.’
The Danger of Over-Sensationalizing
The podcast also discusses the topic of seeing demons behind every odd event, critiquing both Hollywood's exaggeration and some religious leaders’ tendency toward over-interpretation. Jock Brocas stresses the importance of maintaining a balanced educational approach, recognizing the necessity for discernment, and not attributing all evil to spiritual entities. Dr. Richard Gallagher agrees, referencing both psychiatric categories and classic theological estimates. For example, Saint Thomas Aquinas suggested only 10% of human evil is directly influenced by spirits.
Brocas and Gallagher concur that not everyone who commits evil is possessed, but many can be influenced by nefarious intelligences. The various forms of attack include oppression, possession, infestation, and sometimes spiritual influence, rather than outright possession, plays a role in the actions of murderers, sociopaths, or even notorious historical figures like Hitler, who is referenced as an example of someone who dabbled in the occult. Yet, both Brocas and Gallagher warn against blaming all evil on spirits, emphasizing human responsibility.
Notable Deadly Departed Quote: Jock Brocas
‘I use the term knowing, rather than believing, that there are evil spirits. It seems that the only way that you would accept it, is if you experience it. And nobody really wants to experience anything like it because it scars you for life. But there's enough evidence throughout history that there is something else that's nefarious that's out there.
And I always say to people, look, we only know evil because good exists. We only know hot because cold exists, and we only know light because dark exists. So why get to the point of denying the potential? The evil is out there. And I know, I've read a lot of papers in psychiatry and even in psychology and transpersonal psychology where they try to label evil as just some kind of mental construct that really isn't evil in its sense, but yet we know that it exists.’
I would like to add that when new legislation is drafted to deal with cult crimes involving potential demonic influences, there should be no such thing as a ‘demon’s defence’ ie: Your Honour, it wasn’t me. A demon made me do it. No different to the so called ‘drunk’s defence’, which should not be permissible. Alcoholics need to seek treatment to overcome their addictions. Perhaps dark occultists who become literal lost souls because they choose to sell their soul, and become so mentally diseased that they are driven to inflict serious harm upon upon others, need to do the same.
Obsession with Possession, Discernment & The Screwtape Letters
As the Deadly Departed podcast draws to a close, Dr. Richard Gallagher reveals plans for a new book that will place demonic phenomena within the broader context of the supernatural and paranormal and agrees with Brocas about the perennial need to bridge science and spirituality, advocating for empirical inquiry alongside rational and faith-based approaches.
Notable Deadly Departed Quote: Jock Brocas
‘I'm not going to mention the book, but there's another book that I read in years past. One of the things that I recognized is that the power of discernment seems to be lacking even, I think, in the Catholic Church and Christianity because there's a danger that you tend to see the demonic everywhere. There's books that I've read that have been written by religious scholars where it was getting to the point that this particular individual would be seeing a demon in a burger… And anybody who hasn't read Demonic Force really should because there is a lot of empirical evidence; anomalous phenomena that's explained from a scientific perspective.
But we also need to keep that education going because there is the problem that people think they're possessed and they're not. And religious pastors, priests tend to also get to the point where they see demons everywhere... Maybe there's a bit more discernment that's needed there.’
Dr Richard Gallagher
‘Well, you know, I actually think, Jock, you're talking more about Christian fundamentalists and Catholics. I mean, you know, I know many Catholic priests.. and most of these priests, they're pretty educated guys… there are a few exceptions, but they're not jumping to seeing demons everywhere... You got to remember Catholic priests do this as a ministry. They don't make money off of it. Once you get people who start to charge for their services, I tell people you should stay away from them. Like the plague...
C.S. Lewis was a very, very educated and knowledgeable Christian, including about the demonic. He had the classic passage from The Screwtape Letters*… which I quote in my book, which is that the demons are very happy when people don't believe in them. Yeah, but they were also happy when people get overly preoccupied and, as you put it, see the devil everywhere or get immersed in, you know, trying to communicate with the devil. He said we have to avoid both extremes. And, you know, Lewis was not a Catholic, but a lot of his beliefs were very, very close to what the Catholic Church teaches.’
Jock Brocas:
‘I think he was ahead of his time, Richard, actually, because I love that book, and if anybody hasn't read it, and you want to understand demonology, definitely The Screwtape Letters. There's a lot of wisdom and there's a lot of knowledge in there.’
Dr Richard Gallagher:
‘Well, you know, it's a paradoxical truth that on the one hand, I mean, demons do show their colors at times. In other words, you know, the cases I write about, the possessions, the severe oppressions, even what we call the infestations, those are the main categories of overt demonic attack. But it's interesting, at the same time, they sometimes do that to... punish people, to sadistically… torture people, etc. At other times, they want to remain hidden, and it's almost like they have a strategy.’
Brocas and Gallagher conclude that ultimately, the mystery persists: the world of evil spirits remains as shadowy and enigmatic as ever, inviting us to ask questions, seek evidence, and stay open to both science and the supernatural.
References
Chuck Swindoll Jr Video Essay (28 March 2020 - 36 mins): Lucifer and Luciferians: Masters of Deception
*The Screwtape Letters by C.S. Lewis (1942) was written in a satirical, epistolary style as a series of 31 letters from a senior demon, Screwtape, to his nephew, Wormwood, and explores the subtle ways demons attempt to lead humans away from God, using psychological manipulation and spiritual deception.
1. World Council for Health forum: Trauma-based Mind Control and Organized Ritual Abuse - A Healing Exploration.
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